| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3] > | Job with insanely tight deadlines - feedback needed Thread poster: Whitney Maslak
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Steven Segaert
Estonia
Local time: 13:10
Member (2012)
English to Dutch
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| Probably not the kind of client you want | Jul 6, 2013 |
Hi Whitney,
I personally count 300 words per hour, to be on the safe side. The number of hours I can put in depends on the day and the period of the year, so my estimate is personal - as should yours be.
More importantly, I think you should use the position you are in (another job, just starting) to find clients whose workflow fits yours. In my opinion, it would be a mistake to try to find high-speed, high-volume (low-paid?) assignments just to fill your agenda. You a... See more Hi Whitney,
I personally count 300 words per hour, to be on the safe side. The number of hours I can put in depends on the day and the period of the year, so my estimate is personal - as should yours be.
More importantly, I think you should use the position you are in (another job, just starting) to find clients whose workflow fits yours. In my opinion, it would be a mistake to try to find high-speed, high-volume (low-paid?) assignments just to fill your agenda. You are generating stress for yourself, and you will maneuver yourself into a position where you won't have time for better assignments.
Better to do it the other way around - work a bit slower, try to get the high-quality stuff, get a few good clients you give priority to, and fill the gaps with the rest when it is possible. That will also allow you to make easier decisions. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Nicole Schnell 
United States
Local time: 03:10
English to German
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In memoriam | It depends on the topic. | Jul 6, 2013 |
Please, never get fooled or put under pressure by any "statistics".
Even as an absolute beginner you will be able to churn out several thousands of translated words per day of shallow discussions on some social media portal.
The story looks a bit different as soon as you have to translate marketing, PR or speeches of CEOs or politicians, where each and every word has to be weighed carefully. All of the sudden, translation turns into a game of chess: "If I phrase this sentence... See more Please, never get fooled or put under pressure by any "statistics".
Even as an absolute beginner you will be able to churn out several thousands of translated words per day of shallow discussions on some social media portal.
The story looks a bit different as soon as you have to translate marketing, PR or speeches of CEOs or politicians, where each and every word has to be weighed carefully. All of the sudden, translation turns into a game of chess: "If I phrase this sentence like this, it might be interpreted negatively. Hm, I must rephrase that. Darn, this direct translation of this term has a negative connotation with the opposing party, I have to find an alternative, something that sounds more neutral and less opinionated...," etc.
This is where true translation starts.
I yet have to meet a translator who can write five different diplomatic, yet glowing PR articles (equaling 3000 words) for some oil company after a devastating oil spill in one day. Or the speech of the President of some country in the required diplomatic manner at the speed that some PMs consider "regular output". ▲ Collapse
| | | | Randy CUI
China
Local time: 19:10
English to Chinese
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| A story about insanely tight deadlines | Jul 6, 2013 |
I have heard of a story recently. A contract was signed between a China-based translation agency and a freelance translator, under which the translator was required to translate a 30,000-word French text into Chinese within less than three days and a half. To be precise, the translator was to have submitted his translations by that tight deadline.
It is my belief that nobody except for a superman can possibly handle roughly 10,000 source words per day. As it turned out, the said tr... See more I have heard of a story recently. A contract was signed between a China-based translation agency and a freelance translator, under which the translator was required to translate a 30,000-word French text into Chinese within less than three days and a half. To be precise, the translator was to have submitted his translations by that tight deadline.
It is my belief that nobody except for a superman can possibly handle roughly 10,000 source words per day. As it turned out, the said translator was not a superman and missed the deadline. The result was a war of words on their microbloggings, with the project manager blaming the translator for breach of contract, and the translater questioning the former's poor track record of credibility. Luckily we saw a fairly reasonable solution to the dispute, but not to the potential problem related with the quality of the translation work.
The translator couldn't even manage the work by the deadline, let alone guarantee the quality! What would happen if targeted readers feed back to the end client their reactions to the translation? I keep wondering what sheer courage a project manager needs to impose such an insanley tight deadline on a single translator for such a translation job that is obviously beyond a normal human being's capacity. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Shai Navé
Israel
Local time: 13:10
English to Hebrew
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| One of the problem in our marketplace | Jul 6, 2013 |
...is the lack of professionalism. I don't even refer to the skills of the translator, just the fact that so many in the marketplace are in it just for the money, with no regard to any professional consideration.
Randy's story (and I've encountered similar scenarios as well) is an example of a result that could have been easily avoided if a professional would have been involved. In this scenario an agency, which is most likely a reseller of translation services, who don't know their... See more ...is the lack of professionalism. I don't even refer to the skills of the translator, just the fact that so many in the marketplace are in it just for the money, with no regard to any professional consideration.
Randy's story (and I've encountered similar scenarios as well) is an example of a result that could have been easily avoided if a professional would have been involved. In this scenario an agency, which is most likely a reseller of translation services, who don't know their business and ignore any professional logic and reasoning, is desperately looking for someone who will just accept their terms, because all they care about is the money they will make out of it. Eventually they find such a translator, most probably an inexperienced, amateur, desperate or fraudulent one, because no professional or anyone with some experience will willingly accept such a task, who probably thinks to him/herself "well, it's a lot of money for 3 days of work and then I'll rest".
The result is that the project ends up as a disaster, and this is even without addressing the quality issues that are probably present.
This result could have been easily avoided if either of parties involved really understood their business, the in-and-outs of the work, and respected their (alleged) profession.
This is one reason for why true professionals (Translators and real Agencies) should start separating themselves from the 'marketplace' in its current form. ▲ Collapse
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2GT
Italy
Local time: 12:10
English to Italian
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Nicole Schnell:
Even as an absolute beginner you will be able to churn out several thousands of translated words per day of shallow discussions on some social media portal.
The story looks a bit different as soon as you have to translate (...) politicians.
It depends on which politician and what context you are translating about.
I have translated tons of G8 speeches and they were as shallow (or even more if possible) as some discussions you can find on some social networks or some web forums.
Gianni
| | | | Whitney Maslak
United States
Local time: 04:10
German to English
TOPIC STARTER | Really good points, Shai Nave. | Jul 6, 2013 |
Shai Nave wrote:
...is the lack of professionalism. I don't even refer to the skills of the translator, just the fact that so many in the marketplace are in it just for the money, with no regard to any professional consideration.
Randy's story (and I've encountered similar scenarios as well) is an example of a result that could have been easily avoided if a professional would have been involved. In this scenario an agency, which is most likely a reseller of translation services, who don't know their business and ignore any professional logic and reasoning, is desperately looking for someone who will just accept their terms, because all they care about is the money they will make out of it. Eventually they find such a translator, most probably an inexperienced, amateur, desperate or fraudulent one, because no professional or anyone with some experience will willingly accept such a task, who probably thinks to him/herself "well, it's a lot of money for 3 days of work and then I'll rest".
The result is that the project ends up as a disaster, and this is even without addressing the quality issues that are probably present.
This result could have been easily avoided if either of parties involved really understood their business, the in-and-outs of the work, and respected their (alleged) profession.
This is one reason for why true professionals (Translators and real Agencies) should start separating themselves from the 'marketplace' in its current form.
I think so many people don't really understand what it takes for someone to produce a good translation, and they just want it as quickly and cheaply as possible, with no regard to quality. I always shudder when I go on an agency's website and their motto is something like, "Lightning-fast turnaround, lowest prices on the web!" I understand that everyone wants to get a good price and everything, but people have to understand after a while that you get what you pay for.
I think, too, that sometimes translators are to blame for encouraging this kind of behavior with business. I understand being desperate for work, but that shouldn't mean you take anything that comes along for any price. Though I don't have a lot of experience in the professional world of translation, I try to keep my standards high.
| | | | | Technically, we haven't met ;P | Jul 6, 2013 |
Nicole Schnell wrote:
I yet have to meet a translator who can write five different diplomatic, yet glowing PR articles (equaling 3000 words) for some oil company after a devastating oil spill in one day. Or the speech of the President of some country in the required diplomatic manner at the speed that some PMs consider "regular output".
| | | | | a matter of choice | Jul 7, 2013 |
as a matter of fact, we are free either to accept this offer or to reject it, right?
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Randy CUI
China
Local time: 19:10
English to Chinese
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| Lack of professionalism | Jul 8, 2013 |
Shai Nave wrote:
...is the lack of professionalism. I don't even refer to the skills of the translator, just the fact that so many in the marketplace are in it just for the money, with no regard to any professional consideration.
...
This result could have been easily avoided if either of parties involved really understood their business, the in-and-outs of the work, and respected their (alleged) profession.
This is one reason for why true professionals (Translators and real Agencies) should start separating themselves from the 'marketplace' in its current form.
Yes, I can't agree with you more, Shai.
If the problem continues unchecked, all the parties will have to suffer in the end. Is the market likely to correct itself, and do it at cost to no one? Perhaps it is high time for professionals to start behaving professionally.
| | | | Randy CUI
China
Local time: 19:10
English to Chinese
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| Theoretically yes | Jul 8, 2013 |
Yurizx wrote:
as a matter of fact, we are free either to accept this offer or to reject it, right?
and in fact some of us have rejected offers of this type. But most of us wish to make a decent living as translators, and what we're facing is more of a buyer's market. So we are not always free to accept offers like this or to reject them.
| | | | | I've rejected tight deadlines too | Jul 8, 2013 |
Depending on some particulars, sometimes to do with the agency that was asking, sometimes the absence of a rush fee.
PMs and generally agencies may be operating on the 'just try' principle: if it works, why not do it; if it doesn't work, loosen up this time or the next. Don't be baffled and accepting, just turn it down and make the PM (or whoever is asking) aware that his expectations are far from what's normal or acceptable. Otherwise a 'new normal' will be defined (at least for yo... See more Depending on some particulars, sometimes to do with the agency that was asking, sometimes the absence of a rush fee.
PMs and generally agencies may be operating on the 'just try' principle: if it works, why not do it; if it doesn't work, loosen up this time or the next. Don't be baffled and accepting, just turn it down and make the PM (or whoever is asking) aware that his expectations are far from what's normal or acceptable. Otherwise a 'new normal' will be defined (at least for you, who knows about other translators).
At any rate, while cash is more of a personal and subjective matter, I think liability might be less so. IMHO we need to stand up to people who want us to work like a packing donkey on steroids but still deliver 'best quality' and pass a nitpicking QA process.
[Edited at 2013-07-08 11:35 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | Nicole Schnell
United States
Local time: 03:10
English to German
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In memoriam
Łukasz Gos-Furmankiewicz wrote:
if it works, why not do it; if it doesn't work, loosen up this time or the next. Don't be baffled and accepting, just turn it down and make the PM (or whoever is asking) aware that his expectations are far from what's normal or acceptable.
I have a client who regularly asks me to "break in" new hires. Sometimes new PMs just don't know how things work, and most of them are eager to learn. Some new PMs who treat their employer's most valuable assets (their best and most reliable linguists, that is) like dirt, will find themselves on the street again in no time.
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| Sometimes I use a shock approach too | Jul 8, 2013 |
Nicole Schnell wrote:
Łukasz Gos-Furmankiewicz wrote:
if it works, why not do it; if it doesn't work, loosen up this time or the next. Don't be baffled and accepting, just turn it down and make the PM (or whoever is asking) aware that his expectations are far from what's normal or acceptable.
I have a client who regularly asks me to "break in" new hires. Sometimes new PMs just don't know how things work, and most of them are eager to learn. Some new PMs who treat their employer's most valuable assets (their best and most reliable linguists, that is) like dirt, will find themselves on the street again in no time.
What I do is break the silence game and tell them in not particularly impolite but still direct words how things are. So far, I've used rather strong terms, in fact, and recently I'm considering the idea of mellowing down a little, saying the same but in a more delicate fashion.
| | | | | Why not negotiate your own deadlines? | Jul 9, 2013 |
I just wanted to add my two cents worth to the debate on deadlines.
I don't think that deadlines are necessarily an "accept or reject" scenario. I think they're negotiable. Whenever I get a request for availability and I don't think that I could complete the job within that time, I send back a reply to say when I could do it. You'd be surprised at how many rush jobs can actually be handed in a full 24 hours later sometimes.
This is quite normal as far as I see it.
In the sam... See more I just wanted to add my two cents worth to the debate on deadlines.
I don't think that deadlines are necessarily an "accept or reject" scenario. I think they're negotiable. Whenever I get a request for availability and I don't think that I could complete the job within that time, I send back a reply to say when I could do it. You'd be surprised at how many rush jobs can actually be handed in a full 24 hours later sometimes.
This is quite normal as far as I see it.
In the same way as a good translator needs to have some leeway for issues, a good project manager does too, so why not try negotiating some of the PM's leeway for yourself? ▲ Collapse
| | | | Sheila Wilson
Spain
Local time: 11:10
Member (2007)
English
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| The OP was concerned about new clients | Jul 9, 2013 |
Whitney Koontz wrote:
I've been searching for work on here and other sites. I was wondering if anyone else thinks that some of the tight deadlines on the jobs are a little ridiculous.
I agree with some of the comments here about what's sometimes possible with regular clients (renegotiating the deadline) and how we ought to accept that sometimes our clients really do need that extra mile from us (working late into the evening, renegotiating other deadlines, skipping breaks, etc.). But those cases all refer to regular, trusted clients who will appreciate the effort.
However, the OP was asking about jobs posted on the BB by clients we've never worked for. In that case, urgent work is a totally different proposition, IMHO. Their methods and interfaces might complicate the job; their wordcount and the quality of the document to be translated certainly need careful checking; their invoicing details need to be collected, in fact we need to research them to be sure we want to risk this job; we need to get express agreement to our terms and conditions; we need to be ready to send the invoice with the translation, not some time later (or at least, I do)...
These extra checks all take time. If a potential new client sends a request accompanied by the text to translate, I certainly don't just fire off a quick email then get down to work. Does anyone here? I think that would be a very dangerous practice. OTOH, I have an agency client I can rely totally on (correct wordcount, no nasty formatting surprises, an agreed rate, and regular-as-clockwork payment), and they can rely on me to drop everything (if possible) and start work immediately if they need something mega-urgently. That's totally different.
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