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Glossary entry

French term or phrase:

Il fallait y penser

English translation:

Someone was bound to think of it; someone was bound to come up with that idea

Added to glossary by Carol Gullidge
Jul 24, 2008 22:51
15 yrs ago
7 viewers *
French term

Il fallait y penser

French to English Other Idioms / Maxims / Sayings
As it happens, this is from a text about the French philosopher Deleuze criticizing the French "new" philosopher BHL for using marketing techniques in the domain of philosophy: "Il fallait y penser!"
It seems to me there are maybe two uses of this phrase, one to mean "It had to be done", in the sense of it being inevitable; the other is slightly different, in the sense of: "C'est tellement simple, mais il fallait y penser!" as a sort of reaction to serendipity, as it were...
I'm sure we must have similar reactions in English, (US English please!) but I'm blowed if I can think of the appropriate expression.
All help gratefully received.
Thanks as ever.
Proposed translations (English)
4 +1 Someone was bound to think of it
2 +2 That's all that we need!
3 +1 someone had to come up with it/have the idea
3 +1 well, I guess we had it coming/comin'
3 +1 Why didn't anyone think of that before? (ironic)
5 -2 someone should think about it
3 it's just a matter of realization
3 there had to be a first time (I suppose)
3 We might have expected it
3 (1st: That took some thinking!) (2nd: It's simple, but still someone had to come up with the idea)
3 -1 it should have been thought of
Change log

Jul 25, 2008 16:06: Carol Gullidge Created KOG entry

Jul 25, 2008 16:06: Carol Gullidge changed "Edited KOG entry" from "<a href="/profile/134264">Carol Gullidge's</a> old entry - "Il fallait y penser"" to ""Someone was bound to think of it""

Votes to reclassify question as PRO/non-PRO:

Non-PRO (1): writeaway

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Discussion

Susan Nicholls (asker) Jul 27, 2008:
I should add, the whole thing is my fault for suggesting the idea of inevitability in the first place, that was my interpretation of the expression in context (a kind of "groan" reaction to BHL, which I don't think was incorrect as an interpretation, but not good translation practice).
Susan Nicholls (asker) Jul 27, 2008:
I was still worrying about all of this washing the dishes this morning... It's the falloir/modal business that is causing the problem I think, simply because it can mean a number of different things. The best I could come up with (up to the elbows in suds) was: "You just had to come up with the idea". Can't say it has much of a ring to it! Or "it just needed someone to come up with the idea", which is closest to Martin's. In the particular case of the Deleuze text though, I am happy with Carol's suggestion.
MatthewLaSon Jul 27, 2008:
Excellent question. Thanks! I still don't think there is any idea of inevitability here. 2nd exampe: c'est simple, il fallait y penser = It's simple, though someone still had think of it. The other one (first one) = That took some thinking!
Susan Nicholls (asker) Jul 26, 2008:
Well, closing the question hasn't stopped the discussion, I think 24 hours is a fair time frame. Carol, please don't get me wrong, your answer did the trick, and it is for the reasons you say that I chose it - not adding anything that wasn't in the source text: neat and efficient! I think there were two things: my need to find a solution for a particular problem, and my interest in knowing more generally what the equivalent saying might be in everyday life. I've been lucky to get lots of input on both fronts!
Martin Cassell Jul 26, 2008:
Susan, I think this question is an excellent example of why a question should be left open. Part of the deal is that the community (now and in the future) also benefits from the discussion -- any link to client deadlines exists only in the asker's mind !!
Emma Paulay Jul 26, 2008:
Of course there's a cultural difference - BHL is on a different planet! ;-))
Carol Gullidge Jul 26, 2008:
...and don't forget, it's not up to us to read the author's mind - ie, beware of over-interpreting, or adding explanations that don't exist in the source text. This should only ever be done when a cultural difference exists - which isn't the case here.
Carol Gullidge Jul 26, 2008:
the way I see it, the notions of "good idea" and "inevitability" go hand in hand in this instance
Susan Nicholls (asker) Jul 26, 2008:
I can see where you are coming from and the more I think about it, the less sure I am about the distinction I made (inevitability vs. good idea). Maybe such are the joys of irony? "Whoever would have thought it?" rather than "It had to happen sometime"? I must admit I still don't see, if the usual French expression is something like: "c'est si simple, il fallait y penser" (no irony), what would the English equivalent be? Maybe just: "What a good idea!" I closed the question just because I had to meet the deadline on the the translation.
MatthewLaSon Jul 26, 2008:
I don't think at all that it's about "inevitability", but rather an imitation of the French expression "il faut le faire/il fallait le faire" (to indicate amazement) where "le faire" is replaced by "y penser".
MatthewLaSon Jul 26, 2008:
It's sarcastic praise when he's saying his idea is amazing. Il fallait y penser = Who would have ever thought of that? (as if it's so amazing that he thought of marketing techniques in the domain of philosophy - NOT!!!)
MatthewLaSon Jul 26, 2008:
I know that this question is closed. But, I'm wondering if "il fallait y penser" means something similar to "Il fallait le faire" (that's amazing!) Who would have ever thought of that?("that's amazing to have thought of that" said sarcastically)?

Proposed translations

+1
9 mins
Selected

Someone was bound to think of it

or Someone had to think of it
Peer comment(s):
agree Jean-Claude Gouin : I'm surprised that nobody else agreed with you ...
1 day 12 mins
many thanks 1045!
Something went wrong...
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "It seems a pity to put an end to all these wonderful ideas, may of which would have been brilliant. This one is the closest to the actual meaning of the SL phrase in my context I think, and also has the understated elegance I associate with Dz. "
+2
4 mins

That's all that we need!

Just a stab. Pretty unsure.

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Note added at 6 mins (2008-07-24 22:58:17 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Or more contemporary: somebody had to do it!
Note from asker:
Yes, somebody had to do it is certainly better than it had to be done. Thanks!
Peer comment(s):
agree Melissa McMahon : I think 'somebody had to do it' is good - 'bemused resignation' would be Dz's attitude to BHL
1 hr
Thanks, Melissa
agree David Goward : with Melissa on this one.
7 hrs
Thanks, David
Something went wrong...
-2
28 mins

someone should think about it

direct translation
Peer comment(s):
disagree writeaway : wrong tense and wrong meaning.
4 hrs
t
disagree David Goward : A direct translation (even a correct one) is not what's called for here.
6 hrs
Thank you very much
Something went wrong...
+1
1 hr

someone had to come up with it/have the idea

(like so many things in life) it was just waiting to be discovered, but it lay there until someone actually did!

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 hr (2008-07-25 00:07:31 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

"Isn't it amazing that someone had to come up with the concept of monitoring blood pressure during surgery?" http://www.codeblog.com/archives/the_scoop/grand_rounds_209....
Peer comment(s):
agree Carol Gullidge : in retrospect, this makes a lot of sense, and you were the 1st to come up with this particular interpretation :)
1 day 8 hrs
thanks Carol -- there are all kinds of ways of approaching this, mine was really aimed at the set phrase ("c'est simple ..."); and my phrasing isn't so far from yours, or a number of others.
Something went wrong...
51 mins

it's just a matter of realization

This is the second sense ("c'est tellement simple, mais il fallait y penser")

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 hr (2008-07-24 23:53:26 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

For the first sense (inevitability) you could say: "it was bound to occur"

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 hr (2008-07-25 00:10:29 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

But in this sense of inevitability the french expression would preferably be "il aurait fallu y penser"
Something went wrong...
+1
11 mins

well, I guess we had it coming/comin'

Just an idea (if it refers to the inevitability)

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2 hrs (2008-07-25 01:47:59 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Agree with your point, Susan. I was thinking of how a philosopher, faced with all this marketing stuff might conclude (philosophically), "Why shouldn't we have to put up with it like everybody else?" My answer sort of came from that angle. Think Melissa's idea is an improvement though!
Note from asker:
Thanks! This is a good one. Although it does connotate punishment a bit (if you Google it all sorts of frightening stuff comes up!)
"We should have seen it coming" would be a pretty good translation in my context. I'm not sure Dz was resigned to BHL, I get the impression he was pretty close to furious with the whole business, but he didn't enjoy wasting his energy in that way (and rightly so!) Anyway, as for what was the rpoblem with translating the phrase, it is so common in French, I was sure there must be an equally common one in English - something with "seen it coming" is probably it.
Peer comment(s):
agree Melissa McMahon : a variation would be "(I guess) we should have seen that one coming" - less//cool! btw, meant to finish with "less 'punitive'" :)
56 mins
Melissa, I think your variation is excellent!
Something went wrong...
-1
6 hrs

it should have been thought of

i think so
Peer comment(s):
disagree David Goward : No, a literal translation is not what's required here as it loses the irony of the French.
1 hr
Something went wrong...
+1
7 hrs

Why didn't anyone think of that before? (ironic)

Or,

Now, why didn't I think of that?

I like Helen's and Dave's suggestions, and Melissa's contributions but I do think that it would be good to keep 'think' or 'idea' in the En because that's what these guys are all about. He's criticising BHL's thoughts, his ideas, his philosophy. I don't think he's suggesting that if BHL hadn't done it somebody else would have.
Peer comment(s):
agree MatthewLaSon : I think that this is more the idea. I do not think that "falloir" is about "inevitability". This is meant to be ironic. My translation is more literal, but could viewed as ironic in context.
10 hrs
Thank you, Matthew.
Something went wrong...
8 hrs

there had to be a first time (I suppose)

irony
Something went wrong...
11 hrs

We might have expected it

As in "Oh dear ...".
Something went wrong...
2 days 17 hrs

(1st: That took some thinking!) (2nd: It's simple, but still someone had to come up with the idea)

Hello,

1st example: Il fallait y penser!

This is like saying "il fallait le faire" and replace "le faire" by "y penser". In other words, it means "That took some thinking" instead of saying "That took some doing!"

2nd example (which I'm more sure of)

C'est simple, il faut y penser/il fallait y penser = Something may be simple, but, still, someone has to come with the idea

I'm not going to comment on irony here, as I don't understand the context well enough.

I hope this helps.


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Note added at 28 days (2008-08-22 01:33:13 GMT) Post-grading
--------------------------------------------------

I'm not really in agreement in Emma Pauley's translation. For some reason, I am unable to delete my agree on this webpage. It's really strange....
Something went wrong...
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